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Talk:Super Mario Sunshine: Difference between revisions
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::@Shadow2 I agree with Doc - if something has a discrete gameplay function, than it should be included here (especially - but not exclusively - if they are acknowledged in the "items & objects" section of the Shogakukan Mario encyclopedia, of which many of these allegedly superfluous objects are). I also don't think this article is particularly big. By contrast, ''Super Mario Sunshine'' (149,542 bytes) is only about half the size of the ''[[Super Mario Galaxy]]'' (310,969 bytes) article. I would even say more can be contributed to the Sunshine article in the future (not in listing individual objects - that seems pretty thorough. More so in discussing the nature of the game itself, similar to SMG). - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 17:54, January 22, 2024 (EST) | ::@Shadow2 I agree with Doc - if something has a discrete gameplay function, than it should be included here (especially - but not exclusively - if they are acknowledged in the "items & objects" section of the Shogakukan Mario encyclopedia, of which many of these allegedly superfluous objects are). I also don't think this article is particularly big. By contrast, ''Super Mario Sunshine'' (149,542 bytes) is only about half the size of the ''[[Super Mario Galaxy]]'' (310,969 bytes) article. I would even say more can be contributed to the Sunshine article in the future (not in listing individual objects - that seems pretty thorough. More so in discussing the nature of the game itself, similar to SMG). - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 17:54, January 22, 2024 (EST) | ||
:::I don't think we should document every single thing a thing does, but at least we should have sections for more concretely named things like [[Manhole]] or [[Wall painting]]; even something like flower, nail, and balloon probably. But something like a window or pianta-shaped tree, though? Nah. I mean, don't tell me every railing post cap, every newel, every streetlamp or other hat-mountable objects you find in Odyssey needs its own section because Mario can throw a hat on it to get a coin. {{User:Mario/sig}} 19:15, January 22, 2024 (EST) | :::I don't think we should document every single thing a thing does, but at least we should have sections for more concretely named things like [[Manhole]] or [[Wall painting]]; even something like flower, nail, and balloon probably. But something like a window or pianta-shaped tree, though? Nah. I mean, don't tell me every railing post cap, every newel, every streetlamp or other hat-mountable objects you find in Odyssey needs its own section because Mario can throw a hat on it to get a coin. {{User:Mario/sig}} 19:15, January 22, 2024 (EST) | ||
::::Shared functions can share a section. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 19:19, January 22, 2024 (EST) | |||
:::Honestly, Super Mario Galaxy's page suffers the same problem, in my opinion. Crushing Pillar, Electric Ball, "Rotating Green Platform". Maybe there should be some policy in place to determine where to draw the line, because at what point do you stop? I'm sure if I tried hard enough, I could scrounge through these games to find some sort of tiny "objects" in these games that have distinct features, but really don't need to be talked about. You mention a "discrete gameplay function". Well, what if something gives Mario a single coin when it's sprayed? Doesn't that count as a function. So, would we include every single solitary object, wall, and building that gives Mario a coin? [[User:Shadow2|Shadow2]] ([[User talk:Shadow2|talk]]) 21:09, February 1, 2024 (EST) | |||
::::I do think there is a difference between something that is just part of the terrain (which I do not think should be included) and a discrete object (which I generally do think should be included), but it is not always clear where one should draw that line. Generally, at minimum, I personally try to include what is listed under the "Items & Objects" sections for the games in the [https://archive.org/details/30-th-anniversary-encyclopedia-super-mario-bros.-1985-2015 Shogakukan encyclopedia]. While not all encompassing, Nintendo was directly involved with the production of the text here, and it is best, most accessible primary literature that directly highlight what are true obstacles, items, and objects in most modern Mario games. (It also provides a place for English-speakers to engage with the same material, as the English-localization of the encyclopedia has many errors.) Anything beyond that is usually added by other users, and I do not always agree with those decisions. (Is it really necessary to have water tide and lava tide? It's just freezing water and lava that is moving. Similarly, there are entries in the Sunshine article that might be better understood as an element of the terrain.) However, I do not feel it is appropriate for me alone to tell other users what should or should not be included. Working on articles here is collaborative, and these are often edge-cases. Maybe a wider policy discussion would be helpful. | |||
::::I will say that, if it is something that would be included in the article of a 2D game without pause, I don't see why it shouldn't be in the article for the 3D games. (e.g. the [[sand tide]] is included in the ''[[Super Mario World]]'' article. Why would we omit the crushing pillar from ''Super Mario Galaxy'' if it does the same thing?) - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 22:19, February 1, 2024 (EST) | |||
:::::I have created a spreadsheet for objects as listed in the encyclopedia and a talk post about it [[Category talk:Objects#Directory for objects, items, and obstacles in the Super Mario Encyclopedia|here]]. I thought it would be helpful in contextualizing what counts as an object, what is general terrain, etc. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 15:25, February 16, 2024 (EST) | |||