User:Archivist Toadette/Draft proposals: Difference between revisions

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===Move [[:Category:Outer Space Locations]] to [[:Category:Cosmic Locations]], restrict the term "outer space" and other related terms, and add "outer space" to the list of frequently misused terms===
===Completely do away with console abbreviations in titles for ''Mario Kart'' course articles===
Not too long ago, [[Category talk:Outer Space Locations#Change name to "Cosmic Locations"|a proposal]] was implemented to change the name of [[:Category:Outer Space Locations]] to [[:Category:Cosmic Locations]]. Such proposal was opposed to on the grounds that the term "is synonymous" and "it's a nice umbrella term".
Policy right now dictates that console abbreviations be used for every single title in ''Mario Kart'' course articles that have made at least one "classic" appearence. While I fully understand the logic behind said policy, I don't see how this would work in the long term. In fact, I would even say that it's '''counterintuitive''' to MarioWiki's goals, and here's why:
 
#'''It looks ugly and hurts our professionalism.''' Just think about it for a bit. Those console abbreviations are just Nintendo's way of disambiguating which game each course originates from, and "the game company itself does it" is not a valid enough reason for us to bend backwards in this way.
But I argue...not really. The proposer's request was perfectly rational, the rationales provided for the opposition were bad or otherwise not sufficient enough (no offense), and the proposal was overlooked. Here's why:
#'''It's blatantly inconsistent.''' Barring the supposed "logic" used, how come none of the other pre-''Mario Kart 8'' courses have console abbreviations in their titles? I'd half expect, say, the ''[[Mario Kart DS]]'' variant of Rainbow Road to be titled under "DS Rainbow Road".
*'''It may not be entirely inaccurate, but it's not entirely accurate either.''' As {{user|Super Radio}} (the original proposer) pointed out, the term "[[wiktionary:outer space|outer space]]" is '''''specifically''''' used to refer to the open, near-empty space outside the gravitational sphere of any celestial body. As far as I can tell, [[Outer Space]] from ''[[Super Paper Mario]]'', the locations in ''[[Super Mario Galaxy]]'' (including the [[Comet Observatory]] itself), the worlds of ''[[Super Mario Galaxy 2]]'', the last four worlds of ''[[Super Mario 3D World]]'', and [[Rainbow Road (Wii)|two incarnations]] [[Rainbow Road (Wii U)|of Rainbow Road]] are the only examples . That's literally all. The majority of locations that are purported to be in outer space are heavily implied to be otherwise. [[Cosmic Adventure]], for example, is "said" to be in outer space despite specifically being defined as just a [[Mini-Land]] attraction; the "outer space" backdrop is just a backdrop, more or less. Some locations are also only temporarily in outer space, too. [[Princess Peach's Castle|Peach's Castle]], for example, is pulled into outer space by [[Bowser]] and his minions in both ''[[Paper Mario]]'' and ''[[Super Mario Galaxy]]''. In the case of the former, [[Bowser's Castle]] is also temporarily in outer space! As {{user|Glowsquid}} once said, ''"Furthermore, why would you use an inaccurate and potentially misleading term when dozens of accurate, non-misleading alternatives exist?"''
#'''It hurts navigation.''' Let's say a random reader familiar only with ''[[Mario Kart Wii]]'' wanted to search for [[Maple Treeway]] and started with "maple". There are plenty of articles whose names start with "Maple", but Maple Treeway is nowhere to be found due to the system rarely prioritizing redirects. No, the reader would have to type out almost the full title to get the actual redirect. I even tried searching a few other titles from, but they're all shoved at the bottom of the search below articles on subjects that are far less well known. And keep in mind, Maple Treeway isn't the only title with this kind of problem.
*'''It's vague and scientifically incorrect.''' It boggles the information, without any real benefit to show for it. For example, "[[Superstar Road]] is accessed via a portal as this world is in deep space." What does "deep space" mean anyway? Is it really ''in'' outer space? Or is it underground? Or does it merely have a cosmic backdrop? Example aside, what about the [[Mushroom World]] itself? Isn't it technically ''in'' outer space as well?! Restricting the term "outer space" (and "deep space" for that matter) in favor of the more specific term "cosmic" helps improve the sheer ambiguity and quality of the information.
#'''Not even the Nintendo developers themselves use the system properly.''' I mean, just look at the [[Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass|Booster Course Pass]] and how they handle [[Ninja Hideaway]] and [[Sky-High Sundae]]. You'd expect them to be known as "Tour Ninja Hideaway" and "Tour Sky-High Sundae", but nothing even remotely resembling that is used.
*'''As has been argued before and what will be argued again, the grandfather clause is never a good excuse, anywhere, ever.''' As you can see, "outer space" is just as questionable as other terms that '''used''' to be prevalent on the wiki, such as "beta" or "subspecies" (until they were banned for their own inaccuracies). It feels like yet another wishy-washy stance of "we know it's bad, but we use it anyways because...stuff and things...I think", which should '''never ever''' be considered in professional writing circles.
All in all, I firmly believe that this part of the policy is a detriment to the wiki long-term, and call for its immediate repeal. Keep in mind that this will '''NOT''' affect console abbreviations as they are used within articles, just within article titles.
Basically, I'm proposing that we overturn the decision of the aforementioned proposal, restrict the term "outer space" in favor of "cosmic", and also add "outer space" to the [[MarioWiki:Good writing#Frequently misused terms|list of frequently misused terms]]. "[[wiktionary:Cosmic|Cosmic]]" refers to something that ''merely'' appears to be in outer space but isn't always ''in'' outer space, and thus is more well-defined, clear-cut, and appropriate for any case.
 
'''Proposer:''' {{User|Toadette the Achiever}}<br>
'''Deadline:''' TBA
 
====Support====
#{{user|Toadette the Achiever}} Per proposal.
 
====Oppose====
 
====Comments====

Latest revision as of 15:50, September 20, 2022

Completely do away with console abbreviations in titles for Mario Kart course articles

Policy right now dictates that console abbreviations be used for every single title in Mario Kart course articles that have made at least one "classic" appearence. While I fully understand the logic behind said policy, I don't see how this would work in the long term. In fact, I would even say that it's counterintuitive to MarioWiki's goals, and here's why:

  1. It looks ugly and hurts our professionalism. Just think about it for a bit. Those console abbreviations are just Nintendo's way of disambiguating which game each course originates from, and "the game company itself does it" is not a valid enough reason for us to bend backwards in this way.
  2. It's blatantly inconsistent. Barring the supposed "logic" used, how come none of the other pre-Mario Kart 8 courses have console abbreviations in their titles? I'd half expect, say, the Mario Kart DS variant of Rainbow Road to be titled under "DS Rainbow Road".
  3. It hurts navigation. Let's say a random reader familiar only with Mario Kart Wii wanted to search for Maple Treeway and started with "maple". There are plenty of articles whose names start with "Maple", but Maple Treeway is nowhere to be found due to the system rarely prioritizing redirects. No, the reader would have to type out almost the full title to get the actual redirect. I even tried searching a few other titles from, but they're all shoved at the bottom of the search below articles on subjects that are far less well known. And keep in mind, Maple Treeway isn't the only title with this kind of problem.
  4. Not even the Nintendo developers themselves use the system properly. I mean, just look at the Booster Course Pass and how they handle Ninja Hideaway and Sky-High Sundae. You'd expect them to be known as "Tour Ninja Hideaway" and "Tour Sky-High Sundae", but nothing even remotely resembling that is used.

All in all, I firmly believe that this part of the policy is a detriment to the wiki long-term, and call for its immediate repeal. Keep in mind that this will NOT affect console abbreviations as they are used within articles, just within article titles.

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