Editing Talk:Recipe

<span style="font-size:10.5pt">'''N.B.: Due to the success of [[MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive#Prevent_loss_of_information_.28Recipes.29|this proposal]] (if the link does not work any longer, click [[MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive 9#Prevent_loss_of_information_.28Recipes.29|here]]), ''if the [[:Category:Recipes|Recipes pages]] are eventually merged into this page, all possible recipe combinations and all pieces of important trivia must remain somewhere easily accessible on the wiki''.'''</span> —{{User:Soler/sig}} 15:19, 22 June 2008 (EDT).

Who is removing the Big Cookie!? {{Unsigned|Dreyfus2006}}
:I'm removing the fanon about Tayce T. and Zess T. being sisters. --[[User:Son of Suns|Son of Suns]] 20:40, 19 July 2006 (EDT)

:Put separate recipes in ( ), to save space. <span style="font-family:Kunstler Script; color:#008844;"><font size="5">'''[[User:Wayoshi|W]]'''ayoshi</font></span> 20:42, 19 July 2006 (EDT)

Oh, it's you.  Sorry.  I'm annoyed because you keep removing Big Cookie.  Oh, and I didn't know it was fanon...  I remember the game mentioning that she had a sister in Toad Town that cooked.--[[User:Dreyfus2006|Dreyfus2006]] 20:42, 19 July 2006 (EDT)

:I think the game says that it is ''rumored'' she has a sister in Toad Town. However, if you can find an in-game source confirming they are indeed sisters, you can put the info back in. Sorry about the Big Cookie thing. --[[User:Son of Suns|Son of Suns]] 20:45, 19 July 2006 (EDT)

I RIP CHUNKS OF MY OWN HAIR OUT when I search for Zess T. Recipes and cook a Mistake because I was using Tayce T., Saffron, or Dyliss Recipes instead! - [[User:Paperphailurethemariomonster99|Paperphailurethemariomonster99]]

==Recipes==
For every recipe you include, could you add it to the Recipe Category? {{Unsigned|Dreyfus2006}}
:I'm not sure who signed this, but I just added all PM2 items that have articles that are made by Zess T. (including the reverse Point Swap effect) into the Recipe Category. Everyone can help out by looking at Category:Recipes and adding it here. ;) <span style="font-family:Kunstler Script; color:#008844;"><font size="5">'''[[User:Wayoshi|W]]'''ayoshi</font></span> 21:17, 19 July 2006 (EDT)

Thank you!  I just forgot to sign.--[[User:Dreyfus2006|Dreyfus2006]] 17:03, 20 July 2006 (EDT)

==Too many?==
Should we turn this into a page like [[Badges]] or [[Weapons (SMRPG)]]? There isn't really much to write about besides the recipe name, the game it was in, the combinations, the picture, and the sell price. This is a sample:

{| style="text-align: center; width: 100%; margin: 0 auto; border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1"
|-style="background: #ABC;"
!width="5%"|Name of Recipe
!width="1%"|Sprite
!width="2%"|Sell Price
!width="3%"|Ingredient(s)
!width="10%"|Effect
|-
| Apple Pie
| [[Image:PaperMario Items ApplePie.png]]
| ?
| [[Apple]]<br>+<br>[[Cake Mix]]
| Recovers 5 HP and 15 FP
|}

{{User:Knife/sig1|Spike|got something to say?|Image:Attack_fx_E_badge.PNG|color}}

:I'm saying YYYEEESSS!!!! But how can you fit in all the ingredients in each item when it is made, seriously... {{User:RAP/sig}}

Sigh. Wayoshi's making me ask again, since I've been gone for 10 weeks. Can we merge the recipes page?{{User:Knife/sig}} 23:25, 6 June 2007 (EDT)

==Red Text==

Uh, starting from "H" all the print between the ingrediants is red, even if it's a non-''SPM'' recipe. Is this on purpose or a mistake? Either way it's confusing and I think we should switch the incorrecly red "+"s and "()"s and whatever to black like in the first few sections. - [[User:Walkazo|Walkazo]]


The recipes shouldnt be in red, as it may be confused with a broken link {{User:Tucayo/sig|It should be changed to green}}

PS: And each cook should have its list {{unsigned|Tucayo}}

== New Chart Format! ==

I turned all the equations into charts, and as a result, I was able to do away with the stupid italics/boldface/green scheme, which was confusing and inconsistent. I replaced all the recipes that were already on the page and added a few more I found when double-checking certain things, but all the recipes aren't on here, and while the introduction says that's on purpose, I think it's pretty stupid considering this is '''''the''''' recipes page. All that aside, the new charts look like this:

{| style="text-align: center; width: 100%; margin: 0 auto; border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1"
|-style="background: #ABC;"
!width="25%"|Result
!width="50%"|Recipe
!width="25%"|Chef
|-
|rowspan=2| Meteor Meal
|[[Shooting Star]] + [[Shroom Roast]]
|rowspan=2|Zess T.
|-
|[[Shooting Star]] + [[Shroom Steak]]
|}

I didn't include as many headers as Knife's example above because the sprites, selling price and effects are already covered on the product's page. I based it on the recipes included on ''some'' of the ingredient and product pages, only they list the recipe first, whereas I switch it around to show the alphabetical order. I also swapped the applicable games' titles for the chefs' names. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 23:20, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

== Recipe for land meal ==

I remeber making a bland meal with a mushroom and auper mushroom on my first playthrough of paper mario if anyone can confirm this a valid recipe can they edit the article, although if I find the time I'll probably test it for by myself {{unsigned|P13XD}}

== All paper Mario Recipes ==

I uploaded this photo as all the paper Mario Recipes. What should we do with it? {{User:DaisyLuigi/sig}}
[[File:Super-paper-mario-wii-recipes.png|200px|center]]

:We can't really use this. The resolution is way too low. {{User:Mario/sig}} 14:00, 10 April 2014 (EDT)

==Delete the "List of recipes by ingredient" pages ([[List of Tayce T. recipes by ingredient|Tayce T]], [[List of Zess T. recipes by ingredient|Zess T]], [[List of Saffron and Dyllis Recipes by ingredient|Saffron and Dyllis]])==
{{SettledTPP}}
{{ProposalOutcome|passed|12-0|delete}}

What I said on the [http://www.marioboards.com/index.php?topic=29237.msg1664324#msg1664324 forums] is basically all I'd like to say on the subject. To put it simply, the pages are useless. Besides all the problems with the articles themselves, like the vast number of missing images and the terrible formatting, they're redundant due to the other recipe pages we have, which compiles all of the same information in a simpler format, and I simply do not see anyone specifically looking for what combinations could be made with a single item. Personally, I would rather have what items were needed to create an item I want than have that information scattered across multiple sections ''or'' see which items that item itself could create. If I wanted something related to, say, Life Shrooms, I'd either go to its actual page (the individual pages all cover the same info as the "recipe by ingredients" pages, so no information would be lost) or the main Recipe page; sorting them by ingredients is simply an unnecessary step.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Time Turner}}<br>
'''Deadline''': February 26, 2015, 23:59 GMT

===Delete===
#{{User|Time Turner}} Per my proposal.
#{{User|Vommack}} Per all.
#{{User|SuperYoshiBros}} Per T.T.
#{{User|Mario}} When it comes to two nearly identical articles, the more poorly-formatted article should go. In this case, List of recipes by ingredient pages take the <s>cake</s> junk stew. They also break consistency since we don't create variations of list articles like the bestiaries.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per Time Turner and Mario.
#{{User|Baby Luigi}} These articles were VERY unnecessary. We don't need two articles describing the EXACT subject. As this one is the uglier one, it's going.
#{{User|Megadardery}} Per Time Turner
#{{User|Lumastar}} Kill it with fi- uh, I mean per all.
#{{User|LudwigVon}} By confusion, I change my vote. Per Time Turner.
#{{User|Magikrazy}} yeah, its too confusing. Delete the unnecessary ones.
#{{User|Stonehill}} At most, merge them with this page.
#{{User|Newbee}} Per TT.

===Do not delete===



===Comments===
Say, you said if one wanted to look up what one particular ingredient can do, one can simply look up the pages? Just playing devil's advocate, but wouldn't the List of Ingredients articles be a good at-a-glance resource rather than make someone repeatedly search several articles? {{User:Mario/sig}} 17:00, 12 February 2015 (EST)
:If they wanted to glacne at a multitude of items at the same time, and I cannot think of a reason as to why they would want that, the standard Recipe pages easily fill in that role. After all, we have shortcuts like CTRL + F or ⌘ + F to help navigate lists. I could get that a person has one or two items in their inventory that are kind of useless, so they'd like to see if they could be combined into anything, but I seriously doubt that someone would have enough of those items at a single time to want a list specifically for that purpose. It'd be like if we created spin-offs of the [[Bestiary|bestiaries]] that organize enemies by their location; there's probably people who'd like to know which enemies are in a certain location, but who'd need to know all of the enemies in every location, especially when that information is also either on the individual location pages or the main bestiaries? {{User:Time Turner/sig}}
::Say, the person doesn't know about Ctrl+F, though. Admittedly, I don't know the proportion of the Internet population that doesn't know about the Ctrl+F feature to make this a valid problem. You do have a good point of how ridiculous it is to create variations of the bestiary article, though. In game, I can imagine one scenario where a "List by Ingredient" would come in handy: "Oh, look, [[Cake Mix]]! I wonder what that can be used in recipes", but I'd imagine a quick search accomplishes that better.

::P.S. This harkens back in 2010 where I, still a teen at around 15, expressed my concerns about featuring BOTH "List of Tayce T. recipes" and List of Tayce T. recipes by ingredient, "[...]But still, my complaint: this article is too similar to the one by ingredient." I couldn't put my finger on why I don't like it. Thanks for clarifying it five years later. {{User:Mario/sig}} 17:16, 12 February 2015 (EST)

@Vommack: You have to add a reason to your vote or it will get deleted. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 17:17, 12 February 2015 (EST)


Speaking of, and by the same way, why does this very page exist? It seems redundant, it's role can be filled by separate list of -chef- recipes.. Hmmmm--{{User:Megadardery/sig}} 15:25, 14 February 2015 (EST)

@LudwigVon: Could you elaborate on why you find these pages simpler to navigate in comparison to the others? {{User:Time Turner/sig}}
::I do not like the fact of changing all this to confuse some people , the list of recipes are much more simple to navigate (you have less research to do) instead to go to lots of different pages for looking for a recipe in particular.--[[User:LudwigVon|LudwigVon]] ([[User talk:LudwigVon|talk]]) 18:10, 14 February 2015 (EST)
:::Currently, there are two sets of pages based on the recipes. There's one ([[List of Tayce T. recipes|Tayce T]], [[List of Zess T. recipes|Zess T]], [[List of Saffron and Dyllis recipes|Saffron and Dyllis]]) that's organized by the recipes, and there's another ([[List of Tayce T. recipes by ingredient|Tayce T]], [[List of Zess T. recipes by ingredient|Zess T]], [[List of Saffron and Dyllis Recipes by ingredient|Saffron and Dyllis]]) that's organized by the ingredients. The second set, the one that's based on the ingredients, is the one that's being proposed for deletion, since it's redundant and pointless due to the other set of recipe pages. Deleting the second set will not result in all of the recipes being deleted. {{User:Time Turner/sig}}
::::Oops! The title of Proposal took me to confusion. Is it possible to change my vote ?--[[User:LudwigVon|LudwigVon]] ([[User talk:LudwigVon|talk]]) 18:29, 14 February 2015 (EST)
:::::You can change your vote whenever you want. {{User:Time Turner/sig}}

== Delete this page. (while keeping the standalone List of 'chef' recipes) ==
{{SettledTPP}}
{{ProposalOutcome|failed|3-5|keep}}

Okay hear me, this page is a mess. Putting all the recipes from all the different games in one page is messy, [[List of Tayce T. recipes|The]] [[List of Zess T. recipes|Standalone]] [[List of Saffron and Dyllis recipes|lists]] are far more organized, and more updated. Besides, very few recipes are actually shared by multiple chefs. It's redundant and useless. Even some items are named differently per name, having them separated is the best.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Megadardery}}<br>
'''Deadline''': April 11, 2015, 23:59 GMT

=== Support ===
#{{User|Megadardery}} This page is an extra, it doesn't provide any additional information; they are all in their respective pages. So why do we have to leave it?
#{{User|Burningdragon25}} I agree with that! Must go!
#{{User|Binarystep}} It's a confusing mess. Delete with extreme prejudice.

=== Oppose ===
#{{User|Andymii}} Per Mario in the comments. I agree that the page is in bad shape, but that simply means that the page should be ''fixed'', not deleted. Plus, it's convenient to have everything posted on a single page.
#{{User|Lord Grammaticus}} ...yeah, why not just rewrite it?
#{{User|LudwigVon}} Per all. The article just need to be rewrite. Delete this is not necessary.
#{{User|Tails777}} Yeah per Mario's comment. This is kinda more like the various List of [insert subject here]. Per all on just rewriting it too.
#{{User|Stonehill}} When you stumble upon a messy page, YOU CAN'T JUST OUTRIGHT DELETE IT! You have to rewrite it first! (That's why {{tem|rewrite}} was made in the first place!) If you can't get it right only '''then''' do you tag the page for deletion.

=== Comments ===
I don't know, but if this page is just redundant because the other games cover them, why do we have [[List of characters]], [[List of items]], and [[List of places]]? Wouldn't they be technically redundant and useless too? And they're formatted similarly, except it doesn't have price-listings? But anyway, I don't see the need to delete a generic list; I don't think it's redundant because it can be a repository of all recipes that appeared, but maybe I'm wrong. {{User:Mario/sig}} 19:43, 28 March 2015 (EDT)
:I think the concept behind the page was good, but in its current form, it's a mess. I'm only voting to delete it because there isn't a "Rewrite" section. [[User:Binarystep|Binarystep]] ([[User talk:Binarystep|talk]]) 21:33, 28 March 2015 (EDT)

:List of characters and the rest are far more different lists. They are all generic lists that covers basically, ''all games''. For example, the first supplies the need to show you and let you search for any character you want and the game they first appeared in. This is not a list, I guess this was an attempt to merge all the recipes items into one page, which as mentioned before, is a mess of repeated info. Generally, I'm proposing deleting this page as a 'merge of 3 separate pages'. If you have any ideas of how this page could be (like propose an overhaul), fire ahead. --{{User:Megadardery/sig}} 15:22, 29 March 2015 (EDT)

'''@Andymii:''' Also, I don't see how "convenient" it is to have them all as one page, it's a clutter. Very very few recipes are actually shared by multiple chefs. By the way, I plan on making a dismbig page at [[List of recipes]] to link to all the separated links. ''This'' could be convenient.--{{User:Megadardery/sig}} 15:29, 29 March 2015 (EDT)
:Your proposed article feels like this page except with merely links to the articles. I don't see how this would be convenient since it doesn't provide the at-a-glance aspect like this one does. But maybe I'm BSing here. {{User:Mario/sig}} 04:28, 9 April 2015 (EDT)

Also, I'm proposing to delete this page. Because it is an unnecessary merge that doesn't prove any much more information. Unlinke other list of stuffz, which includes a simplified ''generic'' list of stuffz from all the games. The recipes are only exclusive to the Paper Mario series. And the they aren't shared by different games as much as the stuffz in the other lists (list of items, for example).

I would support this page to exist if the separate 'List of chef recipes' pages didn't exists.--{{User:Megadardery/sig}} 15:54, 8 April 2015 (EDT)

== Egg? ==
{{talk}}
The intro says:
'Additionally, certain items are named differently in different games; for example, the [[Egg]] is named "Egg" in ''[[Paper Mario]]'' and "Mystic Egg" in ''[[Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door]]''. For consistency, all recipes with the Mystic Egg are labeled "Egg".'
But this isn't true, they're different items with different pages, and they're listed separately here. [[User:Blinker|Blinker]] ([[User talk:Blinker|talk]]) 16:42, November 30, 2023 (EST)
:The article treats these ingredients as the same to avoid redundancy. For example, check Fried Egg in the table: there's two different chefs for the recipe but Tayce T. needs Egg while Zess T. needs Mystic Egg, but as ingredients, these eggs are effectively the same item. Now, the current setup is confusing, and I recommend either listing the redundancy anyway (I mean we still have Big Egg and the only reason for it is that Big Egg heals more) or probably just redesigning the table all together. On another note: it doesn't help that the table is difficult on my eyes due to the egregious use of cells with no visual line weight organization; it makes it harder than it needs to be to tell how the ingredients are grouped together. Line breaks in ONE cell is easier for me to read personally; see old revision for Tayce T. recipe [https://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=List_of_Tayce_T._recipes&oldid=2082579]). But I guess that's another topic. {{User:Mario/sig}} 21:06, November 30, 2023 (EST)

==Move the chef-based pages to game-based titles==
{{TPP}}
We currently have the pages [[List of Tayce T. recipes]], [[List of Zess T. recipes]], and [[List of Saffron and Dyllis recipes]]. With the middle game's subject getting a remake with some notable differences in its various systems, including recipes, and for consistency with other game-specific lists, I propose we rename these pages to {{fake link|List of ''Paper Mario'' recipes}} and so on to better allow for a separate page. Honestly, the fact that the third of those includes recipes from ''two'' characters is a bit eyebrow-raising in and of itself. Note that this will not affect the layout of the {{tem|Recipes}} navtemp, just the links. 

'''Proposer''': {{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}}<br>
'''Deadline''': June 9, 2024, 23:59 GMT

===Support===
#{{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}} - Per
#{{User|Mario}} Might be better for memory retention and wiki organization that people are more likely to know the game the recipes are from and not the chef person making it.
#{{user|Super Mario RPG}} People who are less familiar with the games will be able to locate the content more easily this way.
#{{User|Hewer}} Sure, per proposal.
#{{User|Pseudo}} This makes lots of sense, especially from the perspective of a theoretical site visitor who hasn’t played the earlier Paper Mario games.
#{{User|Nintendo101}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Tails777}} I use the recipe pages frequently, I used them recently and even when I went to search up Zess T.'s recipes at least a DAY ago, I was ready to type in "List of TTYD recipes". Really, I feel this should've/could've been done a long time ago.
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Per proposal. The old names should probably be retained as redirects, but like, we should probably be using the game names over the names of characters in them; it'd be as silly as naming the [[List of tattles in Super Paper Mario]] article {{Fake link|List of Tippi's tattles}}.
#{{User|SmokedChili}} Per all.
#{{User|SONIC123CDMANIA+&K(B&ATSA)}} Might as well, though the old names should be redirects, like {{@|Camwoodstock}} said.

===Oppose===

===Comments===

==Merge the corresponding "chef-named meal" items to singular pages==
{{TPP}}
Across the first three ''Paper Mario'' games, there are certain recipes named after the chef who makes them (the exception being the localization for, ironically, the ''first'' game, though the original JP script still has this format) that are for all intents and purposes the same item, which are spread awkwardly across two or three pages while only sometimes linking to the others. Occasionally, the numbers of what is restored are different, but that happens with most of the non-Mushroom or -Syrup items across the games. Here's a list:

;Dinner - "level 1" meal
<gallery widths=70px heights=70px>
PaperMario Items BlandMeal.png|[[Bland Meal]]<br>(''Cathy Dinner'')
Zess Dinner TTYD.png|[[Zess Dinner]]<br>(''Nancy Dinner'')
Dyllis Dinner SPM.png|[[Dyllis Dinner]]<br>(''Jessie Dinner'')
</gallery>

;Special - "level 2" meal
<gallery widths=70px heights=70px>
PaperMario Items YummyMeal.png|[[Yummy Meal]]<br>(''Cathy Special'')
Zess Special TTYD.png|[[Zess Special]]<br>(''Nancy Special'')
Dyllis Special SPM.png|[[Dyllis Special]]<br>(''Jessie Special'')
</gallery>

;Deluxe - "level 3" meal
<gallery widths=70px heights=70px>
PaperMario Items DeluxeFeast.png|[[Deluxe Feast]]<br>(''Cathy Deluxe'')
Zess Deluxe TTYD.png|[[Zess Deluxe]]<br>(''Nancy Deluxe'')
Dyllis Deluxe SPM.png|[[Dyllis Deluxe]]<br>(''Jessie Deluxe'')
</gallery>

;Cookie - a misc. healing item that requires a [[Cake Mix]]
<gallery widths=70px heights=70px>
PaperMario Items BigCookie.png|[[Big Cookie]]<br>(''Cathy Cookie'')
Zess Cookie TTYD.png|[[Zess Cookie]]<br>(''Nancy Cookie'')
</gallery>

;Dynamite - explodes on enemies
<gallery widths=70px heights=70px>
Zess Dynamite TTYD.png|[[Zess Dynamite]]<br>(''Nancy Dynamite'')
Dyllis Dynamite SPM.png|[[Dyllis Dynamite]]<br>(''Jessie Dynamite'')
</gallery>

Note that due to not including the corresponding chef name, the [[Sweet Cookie Snack]] is exempt from the cookie merge despite essentially sharing a sprite with the Zess Cookie. Likewise, this proposal does not include [[Zess Frappe]] and [[Snow Cone]] are also exempt as the latter does not include a chef name. They can be looked at in a different proposal if so desired. The [[Dyllis Breakfast]] and [[Dyllis Lunch]] lack counterparts in either of the other games.

The main issue is what name should take priority, so I'll give a few options:

'''Proposer''': {{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}}<br>
'''Deadline''': June 9, 2024, 23:59 GMT

===Support: Newest first (counting TTYD remake: Zess Dinner, Zess Special, Zess Deluxe, Zess Cookie, Zess Dynamite)===
#{{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}} - Per
#{{user|Blinker}} Per proposal.
#{{user|Super Mario RPG}} Per proposal

===Support: Newest first (not counting TTYD remake: Dyllis Dinner, Dyllis Special, Dyllis Deluxe, Zess Cookie, Dyllis Dynamite)===
#{{user|Blinker}} Not sure about the names though, so I'm voting for both options...

===Support: Oldest -and least specific- first (Bland Meal, Yummy Meal, Deluxe Feast, Big Cookie, Zess Dynamite)===

===Oppose: Leave them split===
#{{User|Hewer}} Eh, I feel like these are probably better off split considering the naming confusion caused by merging them. They seem to me more like multiple similar items than versions of the same item, and [[Talk:Grab Block#Merge White Block with Grab Block 2|similar]] [[Talk:Mushroom Genie#Re-merge Mushroom Genie and Genie of the Lamp|doesn't mean]] [[Talk:Poison Mushroom#Merge Rotten Mushroom into this page|the same]]. It's also odd to be merging items like this regardless of different names, but also exclude certain items from the merge because...their names are different.
#{{User|Mario}} Hinders search, different items with different ingredients with different functions in different games. Might as well merge other items with shared names. I grant you that how these developers handled these Paper Mario ingredient/recipe names with the accompanying recycled sprites is a f[[File:SMB Brick Block Sprite.png]]cking travesty overall though. Maybe these chefs should've patented their worthless recipes.
#{{User|Sparks}} Per all.
#{{User|Ray Trace}} Per all.
#{{User|Jdtendo}} Just because some dishes play the same role does not mean that they are the same item. Even similar-looking dishes like the [[Zess Special]] and the [[Dyllis Special]] have different effects and are made from different ingredients in addition to having different names, and merging them would be more confusing than helpful.
#{{User|Nightwicked Bowser}} Per all
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Per all, especially Jdtendo--it would honestly be ''more'' confusing to merge these just because of their similar effects, than just allow them to persist split up like this. (Personally, if it was up to us, we'd have split Egg Bomb & co. up as well just for consistency's sake, but, well, that's for another proposal... ;P)
#{{user|MegaBowser64}} Per all, this is one of those times where leaving stuff splits offers more clarity.
#{{User|Tails777}} Per all
#{{User|SmokedChili}} Per all.

===Comments===
To be fair, they have to change the effects between TTYD and SPM for the simple fact that FP does not exist in SPM. It's like that with many other items between the two games as well, recipe and otherwise (for instance, [[Electro Pop]], which changes completely for SPM). There's also the case of [[Egg Bomb|Egg Bomb and Egg Missile]], which went through varying designs, recipes, and names but are now merged thanks to a previous proposal. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 15:50, May 26, 2024 (EDT)